The Mormons
I have long held a particular respect for Mormonism -- not the doctrine, which I knew little about, but things like their emphasis on family and traditional values. I admire the success and wholesomeness of many of their members. Even the prohibition against drinking wins my grudging respect.
But when you get down to the nitty-gritty of their beliefs, I'm aghast. In the October 17 issue of Newsweek (Cover article:"The Mormons"), a member of one of the church's highest governing bodies, proclaims that, "He (Joseph Smith) stands alone as a source of doctrine." Really now!
Smith, the founder of Mormonism, is the source of the most outrageous, fantastical claims you can imagine -- which I'm sure he himself believed unequivocally. Remarking once on his massive debt and dozens of lawsuits, he told his followers: "I never told you I was perfect, but there is no error in the revelations which I have taught." Humble? (At least he admitted he wasn't perfect). Arrogant? Misguided? Crazy? Take your pick.
And why is there "no error in the revelations"? Because he said so! No other reason.
No one argues that Smith was not charismatic, persuasive and determined. That he was. He was also crazy by any reasonable standard. He says Jesus and God appeared to him in 1820 (in a "pillar of light over my head") and told him not to join a church because all churches had "fallen away from Christ's true Gospel." Three years later an angel visited him at home ("an ancient prophet from the Americas") setting him off on a search for buried gold plates and telling him to bring forth a new scripture containing (get this!) "an account of Jesus during a post-resurrection visit to America as well as a history of an ancient Israelite people there."
Either Joseph Smith was right about everything he said -- or he was deeply troubled mentally. I'll put my money on the latter. Schitzophenia? Big ego issues? Control issues? I haven't a clue, but I suspect a combination. I just know that millions of Mormons swallow it whole without ever questioning its veracity. And among the believers are well-educated, successful and otherwise intelligent people, a fact I find astonishing about every religion. How can they believe this stuff? I ask myself. But alas, they do, as we well know.
I say "otherwise intelligent" because they're obviously not intelligent in this one area. To blindly believe -- without benefit of evidence -- the most bizaare fairy tales imaginable is NOT to me a sign of intelligence. It's strange that "religion" is the only arena of life in which masses of people docilely accept the claims of others without evidence. In every other area of life, they want evidence, proof. But not with religion.
Really now, can you think of anything more absurd that the idea that God would choose to reveal the Truth of the Universe by means of not one, but several, ancient texts (which incidently also condone slavery, stoning sinners, etc.)? I know, I know . . . yours (not theirs) is the right one . . .
All religions are illogical, yet share in common a certainty that they are right. (And by implication that "you are wrong" -- even if it's not PC to come right out and say it).
Most people see it as a good thing that 64% of Americans are "people of faith." A long-standing and unchallenged assumption in our society says that "religious faith" is a source for good. It's generally accepted that belief in God is a positive thing, and that not believing in God is a is a negative (i.e. bad) thing.
Most people believe that faith and morality are connected. (The evidence says they're not. I would argue that religious people on the whole are less moral, but that's another subject).
I say that these "assumptions" about religion are not correct. Like John Lennon, I can't help but "imagine" that a world without religion would be a better world, but I'm not hopeful.
I've been accused of having a passion about "religion" -- an anti-passion some call it -- and it's true. I suppose it stems in part from having been bamboozled by well-meaning people for 16 years of Catholic school. It's rooted, too, in my conviction that blind faith and certainty about something we cannot possibly know anything about can never a good thing.
But what turns me on most about the subject of religion is 1) It addresses (or shall I say, 'attempts" to address) the most basic questions in the Universe: "Is there a God? What is His nature? What does He want from us? And what happens to me and my family when we die?" And 2) IT SAYS IT KNOWS THE ANSWERS TO EACH OF THESE QUESTIONS! An amazing fact in itself.
Can you think of any questions that's more important than these? Or more unanswerable? I can't.
The arrogance of them to claim to have the answser is my first reaction. That gives way to am amazement over the power of religion. No scholar, scientiest or philosopher in her right mind would claim to "know" answers to these questions, yet each each religion says it "knows". And because it's "religion" and not mathematics or history . . . NOBODY IS ALLOWED TO QUESTION IT!
posted by Jim Fleming @ 9:57 AM
11 comments
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11 Comments:
Jim,
If you really want eye-opening information on the "religion" of "mormonism", I suggest you read John Krakauer's (SP??)"Under The Banner of Heaven"( guy who also wrote "Into Thin Air"). This really gives you a sense of where this so called "religion" started. In my opnion John Smith was NOTHING more than a good salesman. He had to have been to con the members into "tithing" a 1/3 (I think it's that much) of their income to the "church". And with that they will surpass the wealth of the catholic church very soon. Martha
Thank you Martha. As I told you in my email "Under the Banner of Heaven" is on my list. No doubt, Josepth Smith was a good salesman, but is that any reason to believe his rather outlandish claims? Best to you always. Jim
Hi Jim!
Just catching up on your blog here. I was actually wondering, “Hmm, if Jim is Agnostic and needs scientific proof in order to ‘believe’, then why is he writing so much about it?”
Then you said, “I've been accused of having a passion about "religion" -- an anti-passion some call it -- and it's true. I suppose it stems in part from having been bamboozled by well-meaning people for 16 years of Catholic school. It's rooted, too, in my conviction that blind faith and certainty about something we cannot possibly know anything about can never a good thing.”
So you answered my question I have been wondering about...regarding your passion about this matter...
I went to Catholic school when I was younger. I have been mistreated and judged there. It was a ‘negative’ place for me. It discouraged all my beliefs and left my so confused, Jim. I was almost about to go Agnostic.
When I met my girlfriend, she turned me on to Christianity. We started going to a church that was more accepting and non-judgmental. My faith got restored, because of the positive feedback and messages I got from just listening to the sermon, and sharing with other believers. I felt welcomed there, until they started ‘judging harshly’ once again.
A lot of churches are corrupt…like anything in life. In some aspect, it’s good that you didn’t have your children go to church. The mental anguish I went through while attending church school and going to service left me feeling like ‘a bad person’…
Now, in my thirties, I still have ‘faith in God’, and have my own personal relationship with Him. Call it an imaginary friend if you will--- but ‘for me’, believing in God, praying to God in the comfort of my own home is much more gratifying than sitting in a pew at some church where hypocrites love to criticize you.
You make some great points here. You state evidence can’t reveal any truth to religion. Science will never, ever determine this, because spirituality is not of this earth. God is not of this earth. In my beliefs, God made science, He is not going to let his own creation figure out his ingredients of the world. In His own timing, it will be revealed. To have faith and to stick it out, is the ‘test’ per se.
If you were to ‘ask me personally’---here are my answers…(**in my beliefs**)
"Is there a God?”
There has to be. I believe there is, I have faith that there is- because when I pray, I get answers---all the time…
“What is His nature?”
Loving. God is love.
“What does He want from us?”
To treat each other with love. He wants us to look to Him if we come into trouble…He wants us to look to Him when we are happy---He wants us to have gratitude.
“And what happens to me and my family when we die?"
That’s up to you. You only have one life to live, one chance to make things right with God. If you have no faith, then the answers cannot be told to you. ****In my beliefs****I feel that if you’re a good person, you mean well, you treat others with respect,and have remorse for wrongdoings in your life (because we are all human) then we do have a place in heaven with God.
“And 2) IT SAYS IT KNOWS THE ANSWERS TO EACH OF THESE QUESTIONS! An amazing fact in itself.”
I can see you finding that amazing. To have “blind faith” and to love God, is to ‘know the answer’ in a round about way. Sometimes I say, “I don’t only have faith, but I know.” Meaning—my faith is HUGE… Not that I scientifically know, because that’s impossible---science and religion do not go hand-in-hand. God never intended for that to be.
You have answered a question that I have wanted to know about you. I now understand why you write so much about being Agnostic, as if it were a dominated religion. I respect your views, and I hope you didn’t mind that I commented in such a long-winded response. I only wanted to give you ‘my views’ and how I felt about this.
I’m sorry the Catholic church was a bad experience for you---it was for me too. I hope that you do find the answers that you are looking for...
Warmest regards!
Hey Deb,
Thanks for your thoughtful and penetrating comments. You provoked me to write a new Post, which I'm working on. BTW, my Catholic schools education was not a "bad experience for me," as you put it. I have very good memories of it all. Warmest wishes, Jim
As you said:
"I've been accused of having a passion about "religion" -- an anti-passion some call it -- and it's true. I suppose it stems in part from having been bamboozled by well-meaning people for 16 years of Catholic school. It's rooted, too, in my conviction that blind faith and certainty about something we cannot possibly know anything about can never a good thing."
To me, what you said right there, "being bamboozled" is a negative experience, no?
*shrugs* Anyway, glad your experience was a good and warm one then!
All the best~
Deb,
I've been thinking about the question in your last comment ever since I received it. Your question makes perfect sense. I understand why you would naturally assume that being "bamboozled" is a "negative experience." I would assume it, too, in almost all instances. (I've also thought, maybe "bamboozle" is the wrong word to use).
I can only tell you the truth -- and this is after sitting with the question for 10 days. IT WAS NOT A NEGATIVE EXPERIENCE FOR ME. Period. I loved my seven years at St. Gabriels parochial school on West 236th in Riverdale. But I also know with certainty that most of what the nuns and priests told us about God and the Catholic religion was pure bullshit. (I'm not talking about the moral guidelines; that part was good).
For example, they told us that the priest in Mass "miraculously" changed bread and wine into Christ's body and blood. Not symbolically, but in absolute fact. We believed it, of course.
Not a big deal you say? (or some people say). Well I happen to think it IS a big deal to be passing on fiction to kids and telling them it's fact.
Yet, I feel no anger or resentment toward the nuns. I remember them as wonderful dedicated women whose lives were about giving (Sisters of Charity). Yet they were often fun-loving, usually spirited, even worldly. They also believed totally they were doing the work they were "called" to do by God.
They, too, were bamboozled as kids. The difference is, they never grew out of it. Lucky for me, I did.
My feelings about religion are more complicated than simple. I'll get more into this in my next posting.
Thanks Deb for your intellectual stimulation.
Best to you,
Jim
Thank you Jim, for clearing that up for me. I did take it as a negative thing. I apologize for assuming...
As far as passing on 'fiction'----it's all beliefs. When you are in the midst of a Catholic church---their 'beliefs' becomes the 'truth'. It's up to you whether or not you want your children to hear this message. I definitely can see your point though. You cannot say it is a fact---it's a mere belief.
There are so many churches that are corrupt. I never forgot one Sunday morning, while my mother and I were sitting listening to the priest give his sermon, he states that he needs money from the people. He asked if people could donate as much as they could that Sunday, because he wanted to build a guest house for his friends, and that "GOD" would bless us if we did.
To me? And to my mother? This was low. Yes, giving is good, and (in my beliefs) God does bless those who do give, but for a priest to make such a suggestion; for these people (some who were POOR !!!) to give money????????
It digusted my mother and I, and we picked up our stuff, and left right in the middle of mass.
That is one of the many reasons why I left the Catholic churches.
Then again, there are some corrupt Christian churches.
I think it's more of a personal nature to believe and practice your faith wherever it seems suitable.
Thanks so much for sharing that, Jim. Gave me a lot to think about.
All the best!
The man who raised me was the only devout agnostic catholic I've ever known.
He explained to me that he believed in God, but not the devil.
Why would God set it up so He didn't have to punish me if I offended Him.
If your dog gets rabies you've got to put him down yourself. It's the honorable thing to do. He refused to believe in a God that was less honorable than he was.
He also told me that he knew what was right and what was wrong, religion didn't change that.
Just do what you know is right.
If in the end it turns out there's a God, and you've pissed Him off, He made you so it's His fault.
And, if it turns out there is no God, at least doing the right thing never did you any harm.
Although the man had a lot of faults, my philosophies and faiths were profoundly influenced by him.
Bev,
All beliefs are NOT "fiction", as you say. Some beliefs ARE true -- many scientific beliefs, for example. We say a belief is "true" when we have proof that it's true.
Other beliefs -- religious ones, for example -- have no basis in fact, no evidence in support of, nothing except some ancient writings. They are, as you put it, "fiction."
It's interesting how experiences resonate so differently with different people. I remember as a boy our priest asking for money from the pulpit, but most people (e.g., my parents) seemed to NOT have a problem with it. Or at least I never heard much about it (only once and it wasn't a big deal). Yet for you and your mom it was a big issue. Was my priest a better salesman? Was your mom simply more sensitive about the subject than my parents? Who knows?
You say that how you (or anyone) "practice your faith" is a "of a personal nature" and I mostly agree with you. But I don't totally agree with you. To site an earlier example, when 51% of Americans believe that humans were created in their present form less than 10,000 years ago, I am forced to conclude that religion too often leads to ignorance, not the wisdom and knowledge we need MORE of in this world, not LESS of.
In that sense, "religious faith" is more than just "personal." It involves the future wellbeing of the human race.
Best to you, Jim
Bert,
Your observation about God, that "He made you so it's His fault" if we "piss him off" is a good one. That's not to say that such an excuse would work at the Last Judgment. I could see the good Christians yelling: "To hell with him!" Can't you!. (Don't worry: I know it's all stories).
The man who raised you seemed like a smart man. At least he understood that God and his nature CANNOT be known. So why lie to yourself and to others?
If there is a God, I'd rather assume he's "honorable" and not the angry and vengeful (and silly) God in the Old Testament.
Jim
True, my attitude might not get me through the pearly gates, but it will at least leave my unrepentant selfrighteousness intact.
Many times in my life when I have known the right thing to do, but I didn't want to do it, I've thought to myself, "Dang. Gotta shoot the dog."
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